ComicBookGal
Stonecutter
well when was the last time Moe spied on Marge? that would mean the end of that
Rate & Review: "The Wayz We Were" (QABF19)
- Thread starter Brad Lascelle
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Venomrabbit
Stonecutter
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- Dec 27, 2012
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Okay, I wouldn't mourn the end of Quagmire-wannabe Moe either. But like, the way he'd take illegal bets and smuggle pandas and threaten folks with his shotgun ("ol' reliable, as the Moe book calls it iirc) I'm hoping we don't lose that.
OldSchoolerSimpsons
Livin' Like Larry David
Quagmire-wannabe? Moe's been going after Marge since at least season 5.
Same. I'm okay with dumping the suicide jokes, but I would like Moe's character to continue to have a gritty, sleazy "edge" to it. (The Moe who created a bidet by putting a stepstool next to a drinking fountain must live on!).
Venomrabbit
Stonecutter
- Joined
- Dec 27, 2012
- Messages
- 2,524
They predicted the future again, duh.
sideshow ken
Stonecutter
I enjoyed the couch gag. Nice to see Maggie get a lead for a change. I enjoyed Moe and Maya's plot more than Homer's plot. It was nice to see Moe get a second chance and I'm so happy she said yes. Homer just wanted to be left alone and he was being a jerk. People wanted to thank him and praise him for being a hero and he was so negative. Nice episode.
Wile E. the Brain
Enemy (Name your own)
It's worrying when the show can't even write original content when it comes to useless filler. Seriously, how many times have we gotten a prologue or epilogue set in the stone age for no reason other than pulling out a bunch of tired prehistorical jokes.
As for the rest, we have two plots with potential but that never reach it. The traffic jam one is definitely the most useless of them, I think it's the kind of plot that could work for a sort of bottle episode where a lot of characters are stuck in a jam and pass the time one way or another, with insightful interactions between them or something like that. I don't know why it leads to the neighborhood revealing that they think the Simpsons are bad neighbors, in any case all the plot points are really surface-level and don't get a proper ending. I feel like it's one of those plots that just serve as an excuse for doing satire. Except that modern Jean era usually sucks at satire and this is no exception (okay though, the hotline made me chuckle). Just a boring, useless story that feels like the subplot despite giving its name to the episode and the fact it's what it introduces with its prologue.
As for the other plot, I'm sorry but I just can't care any less about Moe finally getting a girl and keeping her at the end when said girl is so poorly written. It's infuriating because said girl is Maya, who was an interesting character and who had genuine chemistry with Moe back in season 20. I'm severely disappointed that they brought her back just to give her the most cliché lines. Really, they're ALL here. It's like she was turned into a robot with no personality whatsoever. What about the fact Moe couldn't see beyond her size at first ? Pffrt, yeah I'm sure it was uninteresting so let's just forget that. What a shame, because again there are good ideas like Moe's fear of losing Maya again and of ending alone because of all his past experiences with someone he loved. I do like the scene where he's against his own reflection (that is, until it's turned into an excuse for references and a lame song, it would have ended with Moe breaking the mirror and it would have been good). Other than that, this is a criminal waste of a good concept and I can't excuse that when it affects the status quo. On paper I'm glad that it gives new opportunities to Moe as a written character (just hope he doesn't completely lose his biting, scumbag personality because that's why we love him) and that it means Maya is probably going to stick around... but please writers, next time she shows up, give her personality back to her.
2/5 generously rounded up from a 1.5.
As for the rest, we have two plots with potential but that never reach it. The traffic jam one is definitely the most useless of them, I think it's the kind of plot that could work for a sort of bottle episode where a lot of characters are stuck in a jam and pass the time one way or another, with insightful interactions between them or something like that. I don't know why it leads to the neighborhood revealing that they think the Simpsons are bad neighbors, in any case all the plot points are really surface-level and don't get a proper ending. I feel like it's one of those plots that just serve as an excuse for doing satire. Except that modern Jean era usually sucks at satire and this is no exception (okay though, the hotline made me chuckle). Just a boring, useless story that feels like the subplot despite giving its name to the episode and the fact it's what it introduces with its prologue.
As for the other plot, I'm sorry but I just can't care any less about Moe finally getting a girl and keeping her at the end when said girl is so poorly written. It's infuriating because said girl is Maya, who was an interesting character and who had genuine chemistry with Moe back in season 20. I'm severely disappointed that they brought her back just to give her the most cliché lines. Really, they're ALL here. It's like she was turned into a robot with no personality whatsoever. What about the fact Moe couldn't see beyond her size at first ? Pffrt, yeah I'm sure it was uninteresting so let's just forget that. What a shame, because again there are good ideas like Moe's fear of losing Maya again and of ending alone because of all his past experiences with someone he loved. I do like the scene where he's against his own reflection (that is, until it's turned into an excuse for references and a lame song, it would have ended with Moe breaking the mirror and it would have been good). Other than that, this is a criminal waste of a good concept and I can't excuse that when it affects the status quo. On paper I'm glad that it gives new opportunities to Moe as a written character (just hope he doesn't completely lose his biting, scumbag personality because that's why we love him) and that it means Maya is probably going to stick around... but please writers, next time she shows up, give her personality back to her.
2/5 generously rounded up from a 1.5.
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Well put @Wile E. the Brain. Also, a little plus for that (edited) screenshot. Amusing.
Maya being this misportrayed is even more annoying now afterwards. Not only was she treated as a MacGuffin object for Moe but she was like a completely different person and waaaay too nice, kind & boring. What happened to her personality? How can you even get her character this wrong unless you actually try to do so by intent? Also, the sole focus on Moe was annoying and I kept wanting them to show us her viewpoint, feeling and thoughts about the conflict, but it wasn't interested in her.
I even more wish that Selman would have handled this episode as I'm sure he could have at least made the love story a bit more interesting that the flat, straightforward and unimaginiative stuff we got here. I know I have complained about Jean's modern work before, but since the last season his output have declined something fierce.
Maya being this misportrayed is even more annoying now afterwards. Not only was she treated as a MacGuffin object for Moe but she was like a completely different person and waaaay too nice, kind & boring. What happened to her personality? How can you even get her character this wrong unless you actually try to do so by intent? Also, the sole focus on Moe was annoying and I kept wanting them to show us her viewpoint, feeling and thoughts about the conflict, but it wasn't interested in her.
I even more wish that Selman would have handled this episode as I'm sure he could have at least made the love story a bit more interesting that the flat, straightforward and unimaginiative stuff we got here. I know I have complained about Jean's modern work before, but since the last season his output have declined something fierce.
I thought this was an 4/5 episode that had 1/5 filler dragging it down. The through lines and connective tissues for the plots were very thin this week, and I dont even remember how the Homer plot was solved. Funny enough, while I call it 1/5 filler, an episode all about traffic that leads into the street getting removed from the map sounds like a creative and hilarious idea, but tacking it on to this more emotional plot just makes it a constant distraction that makes both plots worse.
Seeing the episode start out with no couch gag and theme song got my hopes up because I thought it was Matt Selman, but it was a bait and switch, turns out it was a classic Jean very extended couch gag, followed by an entire opening that led to one gag. Should have tipped me off that it would have been extremely messy. There was a moment of neat animation but I forgot that too. From skimming the comments its clear Im probably a little kinder to this episode since I never saw the original, but oh well. 3/5 for the poll rounded up from a 5/10.
EDIT: changed my mind, this was a 4/10. There were some funny individual moments that could in theory give this a 5 but the way they were both rushed and felt too tonally disparate drags it down a point. I didnt hate it but I felt a character return leading into a status quo change deserved better than this, especially a season after Dad Feelings Limited.
Seeing the episode start out with no couch gag and theme song got my hopes up because I thought it was Matt Selman, but it was a bait and switch, turns out it was a classic Jean very extended couch gag, followed by an entire opening that led to one gag. Should have tipped me off that it would have been extremely messy. There was a moment of neat animation but I forgot that too. From skimming the comments its clear Im probably a little kinder to this episode since I never saw the original, but oh well. 3/5 for the poll rounded up from a 5/10.
EDIT: changed my mind, this was a 4/10. There were some funny individual moments that could in theory give this a 5 but the way they were both rushed and felt too tonally disparate drags it down a point. I didnt hate it but I felt a character return leading into a status quo change deserved better than this, especially a season after Dad Feelings Limited.
The main and sub plots divide was obvious bad. I mean, Moe and Maya plot need to be A (like in original S20 episode), rather than just secondary, fulfill with useless gags.
In short: I really like the initial idea about the problem "status quo unchanged" - Moe anyway should be alone. No. He does deserve better. I like the whole scenes taken from "... Maya Moe" episode, and I like all this part - before and after act 1 cut. The first sons was weird a bit though. The ending (or not…) of this story is really neat. But this time I doesn't feel the same "emotional" like from original episode (ha! I did say in Preview thread about comparing).
As for traffic jams, it wasn't too bad.
I like such moments like Ruth Powers cameo with self-referenced line (however it would be better if she referred to exact number of years (19 after Strong Arms of Ma). I like the satire on apps takes your data, and I have a huge LOL of re-capcha long time gag (because that's true
). However, it felt this plot came just after the title pun (now I understood this), but must say the writers tried on it. Oh, I also liked the people image in the jam.
As a result: Moe's story wasn't SO good (it's good, anyway), the traffic jam wasn't ENOUGH enjoyable, and another Al Jean episode is... well, maybe I missed some his Q-efforts, but dare to suggest it was his the best episode in QABF cycle. It isn't bad, at least
. 3/5 from me
In short: I really like the initial idea about the problem "status quo unchanged" - Moe anyway should be alone. No. He does deserve better. I like the whole scenes taken from "... Maya Moe" episode, and I like all this part - before and after act 1 cut. The first sons was weird a bit though. The ending (or not…) of this story is really neat. But this time I doesn't feel the same "emotional" like from original episode (ha! I did say in Preview thread about comparing).
As for traffic jams, it wasn't too bad.
I like such moments like Ruth Powers cameo with self-referenced line (however it would be better if she referred to exact number of years (19 after Strong Arms of Ma). I like the satire on apps takes your data, and I have a huge LOL of re-capcha long time gag (because that's true). However, it felt this plot came just after the title pun (now I understood this), but must say the writers tried on it. Oh, I also liked the people image in the jam.As a result: Moe's story wasn't SO good (it's good, anyway), the traffic jam wasn't ENOUGH enjoyable, and another Al Jean episode is... well, maybe I missed some his Q-efforts, but dare to suggest it was his the best episode in QABF cycle. It isn't bad, at least
. 3/5 from me
Szyslak100
Stonecutter
Just briefly writing here my impressions so I am up-to-date with this season again. You know, in my stay here, I have untiringly pointed out two problems I have with The Simpsons: firstly, it's very static and extremely self-restricted at the time of changing the big scheme of things, always leaned on the status quo. Secondly, it has a very underdeveloped and overlooked female cast.
I applaud this episode tries to lay foundations so Moe finally leaves behind his suicidal thoughts and frustrating romantic interests, and I'd love to see Maya consolidated as a strong secondary character once and for all. The only error of Eeny Teeny Maya Moe was the lack of bravery to make a definitive change in one of the show's most important characters. Everything else was lovely, unforgettable, and brilliant.
The Wayz We Were comes to remediate that failure. And I hope it does, let's see how weight is its legacy. If the marriage has consequences in the future, that'd be the only virtue of an otherwise emotionless, forgettable, and nonsensical episode. I think the best way to express how much I disliked it is with this statement: if it wasn't for the status quo change and the appreciation people have for that season 20's episode, we'd be comparing this episode with The Seven Beer Itch. Every joke is either overextended, or unfunny, or unsuitable, or cringeworthy. The story is terribly paced, the twists are predictable, the mirrors scene is extremely bizarre, the characterizations are bad (at least Maya is unrecognizable here), Ruth Powers return is outrageous, the callbacks and resemblances with Eeny Teeny Maya Moe are cheap and it leaves a lot of unanswered questions, and the wedding is very overlooked.
Everything was terrible, but I am giving it a 2/5 just in case the writers don't take seven years to exploit this couple as they did with Comic Book Guy and Kumiko. By its own merits, it's a clear 1/5 and I am surprised it has a mixed-to-positive reception.
I applaud this episode tries to lay foundations so Moe finally leaves behind his suicidal thoughts and frustrating romantic interests, and I'd love to see Maya consolidated as a strong secondary character once and for all. The only error of Eeny Teeny Maya Moe was the lack of bravery to make a definitive change in one of the show's most important characters. Everything else was lovely, unforgettable, and brilliant.
The Wayz We Were comes to remediate that failure. And I hope it does, let's see how weight is its legacy. If the marriage has consequences in the future, that'd be the only virtue of an otherwise emotionless, forgettable, and nonsensical episode. I think the best way to express how much I disliked it is with this statement: if it wasn't for the status quo change and the appreciation people have for that season 20's episode, we'd be comparing this episode with The Seven Beer Itch. Every joke is either overextended, or unfunny, or unsuitable, or cringeworthy. The story is terribly paced, the twists are predictable, the mirrors scene is extremely bizarre, the characterizations are bad (at least Maya is unrecognizable here), Ruth Powers return is outrageous, the callbacks and resemblances with Eeny Teeny Maya Moe are cheap and it leaves a lot of unanswered questions, and the wedding is very overlooked.
Everything was terrible, but I am giving it a 2/5 just in case the writers don't take seven years to exploit this couple as they did with Comic Book Guy and Kumiko. By its own merits, it's a clear 1/5 and I am surprised it has a mixed-to-positive reception.
There were a few bits that went on for too long - the couch gag, the prehistoric bit, the "prove you're not a robot" sequences (and the punchline at the end credits was really weak) - so there was a bit of a disjointed feel early on, but the musical numbers were cute. I didn't mind it overall. B-
Despite the big status quo change, this episode wasn't that good. The A and B plots should of being switched around honestly, not sure how to feel about Ruth Powers brief role in this episode, as she states she has lived next to the Simpsons for the past 25 years, yet there is a episode where Sideshow Bob (disguised as someone else) moves into the house Ruth and Laura lived in. I know I probably shouldn't take continuity in The Simpsons seriously, but I like my continuity in shows, and The Simpsons is one of them.
StarfishHair
Junior Camper
- Joined
- Sep 26, 2020
- Messages
- 227
While there is not anything I particularly dislike about this episode it just felt flat and a bit weird. I can't think of why Maya would want to return to Moe and the plot just feels forced. 2/5
Emotions+ satire on technology. Start with the latter (mostly in sub plot).
There was much jokes over modern companies (non replaced by "the defendant", brr). "From Disney+ to HBO Max", "we don't collect your data like Google; btw, we belong to Google", "even face recognition app says 'phew!'" and my favourite - recaptcha long moments (and how visually it was pictured
). The subplot besides it was really meh, to said.
Now, Moe and Maya. They are great couple even she came not earlier than HD-Simpsons era. If not Moe's exceed misery, hidding in Bart's treehouse and mirrors song, all the emotions would be nice. But instead, callback to "Eany Meenie Maya Moe" and the ending were nice.
I believe, if the staff will dare want to continue this story, this episode will be seen as goodstart part of continuity.
plot 16/25 (10/15 + 6/10)
absurdity (the possibility of what is happening and whether I liked it) 20/25
comedy 15/25 (8/15 + 7/10)
originality (level of references and whether I liked them) 24/25
TOTAL 75/100 (3/5, downtaken from 3.5, with rounding, or B-) SOLID!
There was much jokes over modern companies (non replaced by "the defendant", brr). "From Disney+ to HBO Max", "we don't collect your data like Google; btw, we belong to Google", "even face recognition app says 'phew!'" and my favourite - recaptcha long moments (and how visually it was pictured
). The subplot besides it was really meh, to said.Now, Moe and Maya. They are great couple even she came not earlier than HD-Simpsons era. If not Moe's exceed misery, hidding in Bart's treehouse and mirrors song, all the emotions would be nice. But instead, callback to "Eany Meenie Maya Moe" and the ending were nice.
I believe, if the staff will dare want to continue this story, this episode will be seen as good
plot 16/25 (10/15 + 6/10)
absurdity (the possibility of what is happening and whether I liked it) 20/25
comedy 15/25 (8/15 + 7/10)
originality (level of references and whether I liked them) 24/25
TOTAL 75/100 (3/5, downtaken from 3.5, with rounding, or B-) SOLID!
tyler
A Burden on Online Simpsons Fandom Since '13
That captcha joke feels like suffocating, it just never seems to let go. Will it be funny at the eighth iteration of the same extremely specific observation? Are you laughing???
By and large this is just incompetent, the traffic jam idea is a good one and has a few solid visual gags upfront but its wasted and I couldn't tell you what the actual story is, and I generally just don't like these stories that revolve around The Simpsons (family) being so important, the utmost reviled or utmost heroes, too cartoony, but its a non-starter anyway so meh. The more pressing issue is Moe x Maya OTP, which is given an utterly pathetic handwave of a canon shift without so much as one line of dialogue articulating the specific reasons behind their relationship. Eeny Teeny Maya Moe is not great but besides its third act that only feels so convolutedly status quoy in its drama out of sheer fear of changing anything ever, it is very much charming and Maya and Moe have a chemistry with likewise struggles but also like-minded senses of humor, there is a clear sense of why they work together. Here, Maya is braindead and puppy dog eyed and has no semblance of agency, reduced to plot device for a generic story about Moe's self doubt, a facet that could be effective if accentuated by a meaningful story, something that feels worth being afraid of losing, but is so vague in its presentation that the object of affection could really be anyone, their past basically factors none into either how they interact now or how Moe has to overcome his fears and worries, its confounding. I respect (maybe) committing to the ship but it feels pretty empty with this indicator that Maya has been reduced to a humorless shell with nothing to offer but to relieve Moe of his Woe. Its very very unearned and sappy.
By and large this is just incompetent, the traffic jam idea is a good one and has a few solid visual gags upfront but its wasted and I couldn't tell you what the actual story is, and I generally just don't like these stories that revolve around The Simpsons (family) being so important, the utmost reviled or utmost heroes, too cartoony, but its a non-starter anyway so meh. The more pressing issue is Moe x Maya OTP, which is given an utterly pathetic handwave of a canon shift without so much as one line of dialogue articulating the specific reasons behind their relationship. Eeny Teeny Maya Moe is not great but besides its third act that only feels so convolutedly status quoy in its drama out of sheer fear of changing anything ever, it is very much charming and Maya and Moe have a chemistry with likewise struggles but also like-minded senses of humor, there is a clear sense of why they work together. Here, Maya is braindead and puppy dog eyed and has no semblance of agency, reduced to plot device for a generic story about Moe's self doubt, a facet that could be effective if accentuated by a meaningful story, something that feels worth being afraid of losing, but is so vague in its presentation that the object of affection could really be anyone, their past basically factors none into either how they interact now or how Moe has to overcome his fears and worries, its confounding. I respect (maybe) committing to the ship but it feels pretty empty with this indicator that Maya has been reduced to a humorless shell with nothing to offer but to relieve Moe of his Woe. Its very very unearned and sappy.
Continuing my catching up on s33 on UK Disney+, I thought this episode was good overall, if a little all over the place.
It was off to a strong start with that couch gag and caveman intro. I liked the framing device of a massive traffic jam on Evergreen Terrace, and I laughed a lot at Homer's line in bed "Ooo Marge, you haven't honked like this since high school!" I loved the little details like just Milhouse and Bart in the front yard and Milhouse's name on his jersey, plus that they reference that Ruth Powers still lives next door and is upset that Marge doesn't talk to her anymore.
All that initial setup to serve Moe getting back together with Maya was great, but I feel like the episode made a mistake in trying to treat both the traffic storyline and the Moe/Maya storyline as equals when the traffic storyline could've fallen by the wayside once Moe and Maya start speaking to each other. I would have preferred we focussed more on the traffic storyline personally, as that's not something that I've seen done on the show in recent memory and I'm always a fan of episodes that show smaller, grounded moments in the Simpsons daily lives, but maybe it wouldn't have worked as well for a full 22 minutes. As it stands, I feel like we cut back to the traffic thread too infrequently to remember that it's still going on, but enough that you can't quite tell which is meant to be the main storyline this episode (or at least, I couldn't).
The Moe and Maya parts of this episode I quite liked. I'm glad that Moe ended up actually sticking with Maya in the end, I was expecting them to come up with an excuse in the last 5 minutes to separate them again and that would have been super frustrating. We've had enough episodes about Moe's failing love life to last a thousand lifetimes. I didn't laugh a whole lot during their story aside from the coupon end scene, but it's nice to see some character progression for Moe. Great bit of animation for the multiple Moe's in the mirror and liked the little scene of everyone's silhouette singing as Moe and Maya embraced. Wasn't a fan of that random musical number in the middle though, made it seem like they couldn't figure out how to get Homer into the scene so they just came up with that song and it felt really out of place.
So overall I'm a fan of The Wayz We Were, despite the feeling of two episodes crammed into one. There's some great traffic jam stuff in here (I liked the joke of having to listen to other people who are stuck in the Wayz call) and some sweet Moe/Maya moments that don't quite gel together properly after the opening act. Very glad to see Moe actually advance as a character in some way. Hope it sticks.
A low 4/5 for this one.
It was off to a strong start with that couch gag and caveman intro. I liked the framing device of a massive traffic jam on Evergreen Terrace, and I laughed a lot at Homer's line in bed "Ooo Marge, you haven't honked like this since high school!" I loved the little details like just Milhouse and Bart in the front yard and Milhouse's name on his jersey, plus that they reference that Ruth Powers still lives next door and is upset that Marge doesn't talk to her anymore.
All that initial setup to serve Moe getting back together with Maya was great, but I feel like the episode made a mistake in trying to treat both the traffic storyline and the Moe/Maya storyline as equals when the traffic storyline could've fallen by the wayside once Moe and Maya start speaking to each other. I would have preferred we focussed more on the traffic storyline personally, as that's not something that I've seen done on the show in recent memory and I'm always a fan of episodes that show smaller, grounded moments in the Simpsons daily lives, but maybe it wouldn't have worked as well for a full 22 minutes. As it stands, I feel like we cut back to the traffic thread too infrequently to remember that it's still going on, but enough that you can't quite tell which is meant to be the main storyline this episode (or at least, I couldn't).
The Moe and Maya parts of this episode I quite liked. I'm glad that Moe ended up actually sticking with Maya in the end, I was expecting them to come up with an excuse in the last 5 minutes to separate them again and that would have been super frustrating. We've had enough episodes about Moe's failing love life to last a thousand lifetimes. I didn't laugh a whole lot during their story aside from the coupon end scene, but it's nice to see some character progression for Moe. Great bit of animation for the multiple Moe's in the mirror and liked the little scene of everyone's silhouette singing as Moe and Maya embraced. Wasn't a fan of that random musical number in the middle though, made it seem like they couldn't figure out how to get Homer into the scene so they just came up with that song and it felt really out of place.
So overall I'm a fan of The Wayz We Were, despite the feeling of two episodes crammed into one. There's some great traffic jam stuff in here (I liked the joke of having to listen to other people who are stuck in the Wayz call) and some sweet Moe/Maya moments that don't quite gel together properly after the opening act. Very glad to see Moe actually advance as a character in some way. Hope it sticks.
A low 4/5 for this one.
Stonecutter #7
Stonecutter
Well said 2/5
