Rate & Review: "Marge the Meanie" (UABF15)

How would you rate this episode?


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Brad Lascelle

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Season 33, Episode 20
Original Airdate
: May 8, 2022

Writer: Megan Amram
Director: Timothy Bailey
Showrunner: Al Jean


Synopsis: A surprise from Marge's past has her bonding with Bart and terrifying Homer.

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R&R Poll Average Score: 3.46 / 5 (as of September 23, 2022 / 24 votes)
IMDb User Rating: 6.7 / 10
 
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Okay, forget about what I said about the Marge and Bart plot for Marge the Meanie the other day, this episode was all right. However, the flashback part was kinda crazy in this episode. So... I may have to go for 3/5 for this one
 
I’d call this one decent. There were some interesting character dynamics at play with Bart bonding with Marge over pranks but Marge not actually liking it as well as Homer trying to bond with Lisa but it not working out over the food. The revelation that Marge used to be a prankster was an interesting one, although it really doesn’t jibe with the past that’s been established about her. Still, I’m not a continuity stickler, so I can accept this new character trait. I did think the ending where she reveals she apparently had pranked hundreds of people was a little too far, though. I thought Marge’s plot with the principal to prank Bart out of pranking was kind of predictable; as soon as Marge said her last prank would be a doozy, I figured it would be on Bart.

The plot with Lisa was pretty good. Homer was sweet in trying to bond with her over food, and the fact that they had the same allergies and bonding over that was clever. There were a few drawn-out list gags that made this clearly a Jean episode, like the scene with Brandine at the cash register and that random cutaway scene with Burns.

Not perfect, but solid enough. 4/5
 
Eh. That wasn't bad at all. A few issues with the editing being a little quick and the Mendel/Pea joke getting stale.

It's nice to see a Bart and Marge episode that doesn't turn into Marge giving up on Bart.

I'm going to give this one a 3.5 and round it up to a 4 for the poll.
 
AAAAAHHH!!! Science Alert! The reason 3/4 of the peas are green is because of Mendel's experiments - if you start with green peas and cross-breed them with yellow peas, any green peas that result have one green gene and one yellow gene; if you cross-breed these "hybrid" green peas, 3/4 of them will be green and 1/4 will be yellow. (Actually, he crossed green wrinkled peas with yellow smooth peas at first, and then took the green smooth peas from there and cross-bred them: the ratio of smooth green, wrinkled green, smooth yellow, and wrinkled yellow peas was 9 : 3 : 3 : 1.)
 
No boring at all) I liked most of pranks ("taught lessons").

However, in the same time, the episode was too Homered-up Family Guy-ish (as it was predicted), including *ohhh* the cutaways (again them?!😖). Marge and Bart's connection was pictured ok (actually I waited for worse) and I liked the learnt lessons about pranks to Marge and Bart. It's not so often thing in modern Simpsons.

As for Homer, it was nice he wanted to find a bond with at least one of his kids (though it was blowing, as there were much of such bond cases before) and even lie about it. That story did need more emotions from Lisa's side

The same (or a bit less) as Pretty Whittle Liar the episode had funny gags and jokes inputted by Jean and co (sometimes they're needed as well as focus on the story from Matt Selman and co). Mix it with cute moments, and we'll get a delicious vegan-free meal Homer would like.😋

My favourite were Avatar-waiting jokes. Also I was both enjoyed and surprised by Burns' hit attacks.

AAAAAHHH!!! Science Alert! The reason 3/4 of the peas are green is because of Mendel's experiments - if you start with green peas and cross-breed them with yellow peas, any green peas that result have one green gene and one yellow gene; if you cross-breed these "hybrid" green peas, 3/4 of them will be green and 1/4 will be yellow. (Actually, he crossed green wrinkled peas with yellow smooth peas at first, and then took the green smooth peas from there and cross-bred them: the ratio of smooth green, wrinkled green, smooth yellow, and wrinkled yellow peas was 9 : 3 : 3 : 1.)
Haw😄! Now I understood the humour and the closed credit reverse and chalkboard gag ("I will not violate the law of entropy")

Despite FG-ish it was a really good entertaining episode. 4/5, up from strong 3.5

P.S. Not mentioned yet: The episode was dedicated to animator Ian Wilcox who passed away on April 30th.
 
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Homer and Lisa's plot was nice and reminded me on 18.17 and a bit 28.20.
I did not like Marge's plot, however. So i'm a tad disappointed (i wonder if i m not a bit picky eater), Homer looked sad but not scared.

The reverse credits :D
 
Another retcon? When did Lisa switch from vegetarian to vegan (she used a cheese replacement in one of her dishes)? The only vegan I am aware of on the show is Apu.
 
Another retcon? When did Lisa switch from vegetarian to vegan (she used a cheese replacement in one of her dishes)? The only vegan I am aware of on the show is Apu.
When it comes to frequent characters, yes. But if youre talking about all vegans/vegetarians on the show I have found a list on Simpsons fandom.
 
Maybe she was inspired by meeting Jesse Grass. He won't eat food that casts a shadow.
 
I thought it was fine. The premise was okay, and I do like the B-plot and how it came about. Good ending too. I think the only thing I didnt like was that the Burns accident went on far too long. 3/5.
 
This episode was very boring, I give it a 6/10, or a 3/5 here on NHC. I don't really have much to say about it really, except there are better Marge & Bart storylines (although I can't think of any atm, as I also gave "Marge's Son Poisoning" a 6/10 too).

The only really interesting thing is the reverse opening credits that appeared at the end credits, honestly surprised they haven't done it already.
 
Not much to say about this episode. The Bart and Lisa plot was cute and so was the Homer and Lisa subplot. I will give them a A for originality concerning the original plot. 5/5
 
Does anyone know why they showed the opening sequence in reverse during the credits? Not that I thought it was bad, just curious why they did it. Maybe it had to do with the person they dedicated the episode to?

Also enjoy this mistake I spotted.
Screenshot_20220509-194729.png
 
I really like the core of this episode, but it struggles to rise above the ‘Jean-isms’ that pervade it (seriously, fuck the Family Guy-style cutaway gags). There’s something about the lazy, blasé, haphazard, and stilted dialogue/editing in the scene-to-scene construction of Jean episodes that I don’t detect as strongly (or at all) in many Selman episodes. They don’t flow as smoothly and there’s this weird element of, I dunno, fragmentation that disrupts or interferes with the arcs. Can't really articulate myself at the moment, but whatever it is, it sabotages the episode’s potential.

The idea that Marge was once a troublemaker and bonds with Bart over their shared penchant for mischief is genuinely good. Like, it actually works in that it kind of lines up with little glimpses of a more mischievous side that we’ve seen from her over the years. Think back to her laughing when Lisa threw a shoe at Bart’s head (Itchy & Scratchy Land) or when she laughed at Bart writing ‘Insert Brain Here’ on the back of Homer's head (Deep Space Homer) or when she gleefully let the kids paddle Homer’s butt (Homer the Great) or when she tainted all the Bake Off entries after being screwed over by other contestants (All’s Fair in Oven War). To its credit, the episode doesn’t make this development too inexplicable, revisionist or out-of-character. I'm happy to accept this new dimension to Marge.

I also like the idea of Homer feeling depressed about none of his kids seemingly taking after him. That’s an angle that hasn’t really been explored before. Both plots have some good moments (including but not limited to Homer’s internal monologue at the dinner table, Bart pleading with Marge to continue pranking to validate the only skill he thinks he has, and the endings to both plots), but I walked away feeling as if so much more could have been done. What traits does Homer find positive about himself that he wants to pass down? Does it bother Lisa and/or Homer that Marge has a history as a rambunctious troublemaker? Could Marge hone Bart’s pranking towards people who are unkind or ostensibly deserve it?

That last question is the real missed opportunity for me. The episode sort of suggests that Marge and Bart are compelled to prank people because of perceived injustices, but it doesn’t explore that to the extent it demands. I would have liked to see Marge recognise a moral component in his ‘acting out’ and redirect his mischievous instincts (which have often been random and temperamental) for the purposes of good even if the lesson at the end (i.e. innocent or well-intentioned pranks can get out of hand) remains the same. As it is, the episode is too shallow – there’s just not enough meat on the bone, but there could have been.

For now, it’s no more than a 3/5 from me.
 
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@B-Boy It did feel like the editing was a little abrupt. I mentioned as much in my "Review" but the most glaring scene was when Patty and Selma were over for dinner. It went from Marge seeing her old principal to them talking about Marge being a prankster.

I'm always curious to know where episodes live and die, sometimes the writing is poor, sometimes the jokes fall flat and sometimes it dies in the editing room.
 
Does anyone know why they showed the opening sequence in reverse during the credits? Not that I thought it was bad, just curious why they did it. Maybe it had to do with the person they dedicated the episode to?
It was a PRANK OVER US:lawl: (funny, not?) according to Screen Rant article, which Al Jean shared
As the episode plays opening credits in reverse, the sequence ends with Bart writing “I will not violate the law of entropy” as one of The Simpsons' long-running chalkboard gags. This line shows that the bizarre sequence is a meta-reference to the plot of “Marge the Meanie,” wherein Marge and Bart bond over their shared love of ambitious practical jokes. After an episode during which both Bart and Marge tried to one-up each other when it came to pranks, The Simpsons itself plays one last practical joke on the viewer by putting the opening credits at the end of the episode and playing them backward.

And, yes @John95 , it's partly because of dedication
It is a fun touch that couldn’t come at a more appropriate time since the episode is dedicated to the late Simpsons background layout artist Ian Wilcox. There’s no better way for the show to draw attention to the hard work of its behind-the-scenes team than by messing with the opening credits, leading viewers to see an often-overlooked element of The Simpsons in a new light.
For me it was a nice gag, considering we hadn't got a FULL sequence in a long time
 
but it struggles to rise above the ‘Jean-isms’ that pervade it (seriously, fuck the Family Guy-style cutaway gags)
The sad thing is, if you think about it there's always been jokes like that in the show to some extent. Think of Homer daydreaming that he's the Godfather in Last Exit to Springfield for example. But like many things, it got out of hand in the modern era. The aforementioned example was meant to enhance a joke and to show Homer's vision of what it is to be at the head of the union. Now they really are handled like generic Family Guy-like cutaways even with the same core, I think I fully started to notice it with Burger Kings recently (Homer seeing himself as a fly).
 
Does anyone know why they showed the opening sequence in reverse during the credits? Not that I thought it was bad, just curious why they did it. Maybe it had to do with the person they dedicated the episode to?

Also enjoy this mistake I spotted.
View attachment 2261
Can't see the mistake. Is it about meat in kitchen ? If it's case, i don't think Paul McCartney would sue them. As for the person who said Lisa went to veggie from vegan, don't forget some characters who are either left handed or right handed, depending on the writer. It's been even an episode in which Bart writes with his right hand.
 
I quite liked this episode. Probably one of my favorites of the season. Marge being a prankster is so unlike her her character but it isn't the first time she show her devious side. Liked how she pranked Helen Lovejoy the most since she needs to be taken down a petg What would have made it better if at the end she came up to writing a letter address her she would have said fuck her. Mr. Burns scene went on a little long but what was more annoying was Smithers. Grampa's story line was cool since he won and how the other senior citizens got pumped up to get ready was a joy. The scenes at junior high were accurate as it's a be cool or not cool is a way of life.

Strange to see Patty and Selma still smoking since Disney took over. They were once able to sing soprano . Sad that this really does happen just listen to Marianne Faithfulls "As Tears Go By" when she was younger and older. Plus the smack didn't help.

The Homer and Lisa story was nice.

5/5
 
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Originally, "Marge The Meanie" was going to be the season finale episode, but it was moved to be the antepenultimate episode of the season. And "Poorhouse Rock" originally was going to be the penultimate episode but it was moved to be the season finale episode. "Meat Is Murder" was going to be the episode 20 of the season 33 but "Marge the Meanie" aired instead.
 
After a long streak of Selman-run shows, this one was actually run by Jean, which explains its extra crappiness.
 
Yeah, it had that Jean-touch.

Mainly that the moments with "someone acts extra jerkassy for no real reason to set up them suffering and just revel in it". I mean, it makes more sense here but then there's moments like with Burns where it feels too rubbed in especially when it happens a second time without Marge&Bart doing anything.

Might've felt like there was a stronger reason to try and scare Bart out of pranking if some of the latter ones where against people who weren't entirely deserving but it just seemed funny. Like if Helen just went to the bathroom without repeatedly commenting on Marge but since Marge dislikes Helen anyway and Bart's egging her on then she does that anyway.

But yeah, there's just something ugly about that kinda writing. I guess it's because it's paper thin but I guess I don't also like when I'm being asked specifically to root for someone to suffer. With one or two exceptions I don't really wanna root for people to suffer (and even those exceptions is because they do so much awful shit without punishment or even being treated as unlikeable for way more than other characters constantly get shit for) That and it's usually so lazy.

Not that Selman's really much better but it's this kinda thing which makes it near impossible for me to take the attempts at "wholesomeness" as remotely genuine.
 
I admit that I liked this episode. The premise itself (that of it turning out that Marge had been a bit of a prankster during her school days & bonding with the enthused Bart) really had my interest from when I heard of it & I was skeptical and vary of how they were gonna pull it off in at least an satisfyingly decent manner (mostly due to this being a Jean episode, which often tend to leave the window open for a lot of interferring issues), but it turns out that my worries were mostly unfounded. This, to me, was a pretty nice episode with an enjoyable and often funny Marge & Bart bonding plot but also a nice subplot with Homer trying to bond some with Lisa over their collective love of food (albeit about Lisa's vegan/vegetarian foods) & some nice emotional moments. There were some issues with it that held it back from being anything great, but as a whole, I was entertained and found it generally likeable.

I liked the opening/lead-in with Grampa and his fellow Retirement Castle denizens against their rivals from the snooty high-class retirement home in a game of shuffleboard: It had its amusing moments and gags (such as the orderlies not really caring & Jasper having an odd incident), not to mention I really liked them actually winning. Solid set-up with this old woman keeping staring at Marge & when confronted by the latter, we find out Marge was a troublemaker in school and ruined the woman's life (being Marge's old principal). Bart being excited abut it was hilarious ("We're the same!"), Patty & Selma got an amusing cameo & the flashback was well told (Young marge having to switch schools to a shoddy, run-down one & her mean principal slipping and falling by accident being attributed to her, starting to pull pranks on the principal to fit in and not be bullied) & got the episode off to an entertaining start.

Marge being revealed to have had a bad kid streak during her school years (at least during a period) and having earned the moniker "Marge The Meanie" by her principal (who seemed to have deserved what came to her) was a concept that didn't feel out of place (as Marge has had her naughty moments and not always been so above it all) and spinning this into a plot where she uses the fact as a way to bond with her son was great. The two spending time and prank mean people gave entertaining and funny moments: The Comic Book Guy pranking scene was fun (I also liked the Spider-Man comic homage) & Helen Lovejoy being an asshole to Marge one again was even better (that shopping prank was clever & cathartic: Seeing Helen suffer from shame was so good. I also liked the very topical joke about the rampant grocery prices that keep increasing by the second. That one was on point).

I liked how it wasn't all just fun & games, with Marge having a bedtime chat with Homer about feeling bad after doing her silly childish pranks with her son (even though the people they do it to really deserve it, which differs from Bart. I actually think the victims being bad people made it easy for her, as I cannot see her pranking innocents) and only doing it to get closer to Bart as a mother, finding it very hard to stop because of it: This scene also had some nice jokes (the Avatar sequel discussion felt so awkward I kinda liked it & Homer banging his fist at Bart onto the wall and Bart doing the same back at him was funny). The prank on Mr. Burns (who's again up to no good) was a really cartoonish scene (with him ping-ponging between cars and electrocuted) and went on for too long but still made me chuckle (as did even Bart finding Marge went too far: him quickly vacating the premises was pretty funny).

The scene with Marge at the therapist's office allowed the story to slow down and while this signalled where the episode lost some of its energy and became less interesting, I still liked the way it was done with Marge having to come to terms with her pranking side and do something about her old principal (forgiving her and move on), plus the dry jokes with the therapist were decent (albeit the extra cutaway scene to Burns having had an awakening due to his accident before having another accident was pointless. We just had a long gag scene with him so this just felt very meh). Marge deciding to quit but swayed by a crushed Bart to do one more prank was a nice scene between the two (I seriously think this was one of the most fun Marge-Bart dynamics in the recent seasons).

The last prank with the principal blasted in the face with ink from a flower boquet, causing her apparent death, was an interesting one (I hadn't expected that twist of the prank actually being on Bart so that got me. Kudos for not making it predictable) plus the joke with Chief Wiggum being so dense in regards to not understanding the principal only having faked being dead was pretty good (if a little dragged out). The ending was a neat one, with Marge & Bart making up in a bit of an emotional capper, Marge deciding to leave the pranking and Bart to stop it as well (but we'll see how long that lasts), so as a whole, it was an entertaining and fun story that while not the most organically told (due to the showrunning), had enough positives for me to like how it turned out.

As for the subplot about Homer being sad and downbeat about how not only Bart but Lisa & Maggie as well takes after Marge instead of him and deciding to do something about it by trying connecting with Lisa over food was also a really good one. Surprising they haven't done this plot before but it was handled well, ranging from his quiet disappointment at the dinner table to his increasingly angry conversation with the guys at Moe's to finally hanging around Lisa and trying his best to enjoy the same green foods that she likes (interesting to see Lisa being into cooking: Maybe a future Lisa plot?). Anyhow, a nice dad-daughter bonding, some good jokes & I enjoyed the end twist (it turning out they are both allergic to something in the vegetable soup and Lisa still appreciating Homer's kindness) though the dull allergy list joke was pretty bad & was the "treacle" bit (the doctor was kinda obnoxious).

The episode had some of those troublesome Jean-isms of the modern era (such at at times coming off as kinda awkward and stiff, such as the at time ridgid cutting instead of the smoother approach that Selman tends to go for, but also another goddamn list joke and some weird cutaways), but they weren't as intrusive as they could have been and despite the episode coming off as a little too straightforward and simple (I understand those like @B-Boy who thought they could've done more with the concept & had more of a deep dive into the workings of how Marge was thinking and reasoning), but I didn't mind that and actually liked it for being relatively simple (and some depth was still there) so the positives outweigh the negatives for me (surprising for a Jean episode).

So yeah, this was a good one that felt like a worthwhile 22 mintues. Not excellent in any way but still a fair and above average episode with a couple of fun and interesting stories to tell (and with kind of an energetic Scully-like energy at times, which kept it from being boring). I get those who weren't impressed in any way or just didn't like it (as yeah, there were some definite issues that comes with it being a Jean episode and not a Selman episode) but it kept me invested and entertained and sometimes that's all what's needed (or maybe I was just in a good mood and easily entertained this time, I dunno). Still a pretty decent one.

4/5
 
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I was surprised by how much I liked this. Marge's pranks were actually funny, more creative than when Bart meant that 30 yr old guy who was a prankster and Lisa said loser too often.

Helen was her usual catty but funny self. Loved the items brandine rang up (not Shauna? How unusual. I think I prefer brandine as cashier.)

The ending was kind of predictable but strong acting from Julie kavner and Nancy Cartwright elevated the scene. This is the best mother and son episode since chirpy boy and Bart Jr.

4/5 for the poll. Outstanding, I might actually come and rewatch this when it makes its way to Disney+
 
You know, I actually find it funny that Homer forgot about what Lisa's middle name is. Although Marge already mentioned Lisa's middle name two years ago
 
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